Discussion Thread

Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

  • 1.  Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

    Posted 08-25-2019 05:16 PM
    Hello all,

    My background is in geology and will be graduating soon. At this point in my academic career it is perhaps in my best interest to simply finish up my undergraduate education in geology, essentially finish what I started. Last semester I was in my college's civil department, but due to the financial stresses that cloud my path I had to go back to geology so that I can finish that up and start working to get a hold on my situation, which I luckily do have professional experience in as far as internships go. I have looked and applied to scholarships, for example ones such as those offered by ASCE, but have received nothing, nor from my university application as well. If it means anything, I am completing a minor in environmental engineering.

    I have been an active participant of my university's ASCE student chapter for about a year, and will continue to do so. I participated in representing my university in the local conference, giving a presentation. As one might be able to tell I am dedicated to the Civil Engineering profession, just that I need to access it.

    I have spoken to my mentors and they say that this is not it. What is an option is going back and completing a masters program they tell me. My only concern is this really going to get me into civil, since masters programs essentially have you specialize and not cover a breadth of disciplines like you do in an undergraduate program? For some context, the areas of civil that interested me were water, geotech, and environmental.

    Best,

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    Raul Gil S.M.ASCE
    Las Cruces NM
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  • 2.  RE: Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

    Posted 08-26-2019 08:36 AM
    ​One thing that you may pursue is finding an employer who will work with you, perhaps in environmental engineering or geology capacity, while helping you (paying) for you to take civil engineering coursework to get your undergraduate degree in civil engineering.  Personally, I have pursued (part-time) a masters degree in electrical engineering and an MBA where the company I worked for reimbursed my tuition, in return for my commitment to work for that company for a period of time after graduation.  Sometimes the path requires that you take a few detours ;)

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    Joseph Cioletti R.Eng, A.M.ASCE
    Project Manager
    Mott Macdonald
    Pittsburgh PA
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  • 3.  RE: Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

    Posted 08-26-2019 08:37 AM
    Hi Raul,

    I completed my masters degree and in my program I had a couple of friends who went from a non Civil Engineering undergraduate degree to a Civil Engineering masters degree. They had to take some pre-requisite classes before starting the program but they have now completed it and are working in Civil Engineering positions. If you look for a program for a masters degree in Civil Engineering vs one that is tailored to just one discipline (such as a master in Water Resources Engineering, Structural Engineering, Geotechnical Engineering, etc) you should be able to take a mixture of classes that are not in only one discipline. For example my masters degree is in Civil Engineering but I focused all my classes in water resources while some one else in my same program took all her classes in Geotechnical and Environmental Engineering. We both received the same degree but satisfied our program requirements by taking totally different classes. In terms of funding there are a programs that if you apply to be a graduate research assistant which commits you to doing research for a professor at the university then they will fund your studies and provide you with a stipend. That is how I completed my masters. 

    Hopefully this helps!

    Here is a link to the program I completed while doing research for the Villanova Urban Stormwater Partnership:
    https://www1.villanova.edu/villanova/engineering/departments/cee/graduate/masters.html


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    Stephanie Molina EIT, CFM, A.M.ASCE

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  • 4.  RE: Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

    Posted 08-26-2019 09:49 AM
    Raul,

    It sounds to me like the master's may not be a bad choice.  One of my colleagues came from the mechanical background, got his masters in civil, and is doing well.  Plus, most of the learning is really done on the job.  You may find that the masters program will require you to take extra classes from their undergraduate curriculum since you haven't had those, which may make the standard 2 year masters course closer to 3 years. 

    The other option is to work for a civil firm after school.  I may be incorrect in this next statement so double check me, but depending on your state, you may not have to have a "civil engineering" degree in order to sit for the PE in 4 years.  Our company has hired sever biological engineers and converted them to civil engineering due to the fact that they seem to have a greater understanding of hydrology than their counterparts in the civil department.  They all took the FE and passed it, so they are all legally engineering interns.

    Best of luck.

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    Chase Henrichs , P.E.P.E., M.ASCE
    Crafton Tull
    Rogers, AR
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  • 5.  RE: Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

    Posted 08-26-2019 11:53 AM
    Raul,

    Have you considered working on Dams? I know that my company specifically has hired geologists in the past to work on Dams projects. We have at least one registered geologist on staff. If your goal is to work on civil engineering projects and you don't necessarily care about being the engineer of record, I think it would be a fantastic opportunity for you to get into the profession without having to go through extra schooling.

    Good luck - either way as long as you want to work hard and have a genuine interest you'll find a great spot.

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    Derek Smith EIT, A.M.ASCE
    Transportation Designer
    Gannett Fleming
    Phoenix AZ
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  • 6.  RE: Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

    Posted 08-26-2019 01:57 PM
    Hello,

    I do plan to become an engineering geologist anyway in the short term if I can, maybe with the state of California. Essentially, to give some context, I like both disciplines, but I prefer civil engineering in the long term. Perhaps the perfect for for me would have been an undergrad in Geological Engineering, which I suppose would be a potentially even better fit. But practically speaking I can look into that for the future. I think further education would be necessary to be able to design things like dams, like you mentioned, buildings, ports, and water and wastewater treatment plants etc., plus maintain them. A geologist, I believe, would not be skilled, much less qualified to do that, as their focus is strictly on the natural. Thank you for your contribution.

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    Raul Gil S.M.ASCE
    Las Cruces NM
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  • 7.  RE: Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

    Posted 08-26-2019 12:32 PM
    It has been mentioned already that some states will not let you sit for the PE unless you have a BSCE. You may want to check into this before you decide. Outside of that issue, if civil engineering is what you want to do, go for it. Don't spend your working career regretting you did not follow your dream.

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    Stacey Morris P.E., M.ASCE
    ETI Corporation
    West Memphis AR
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  • 8.  RE: Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

    Posted 08-26-2019 01:57 PM
    Hello,

    My state of legal residence is California. Everything I do is from out of there. Thanks for the reply.

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    Raul Gil S.M.ASCE
    Las Cruces NM
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  • 9.  RE: Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

    Posted 08-26-2019 09:39 PM
    I did something very similar to this a few years ago. Graduated with a BA in International Relations, worked for a bit, and then decided to go back to school for civil engineering. What I ended up doing was applying for a graduate program (since my undergraduate experience taught me that a graduate program was the way to go after undergraduate!), and started taking classes as a non-degree student. Since there were significant prerequisites for the master's program, I ended up taking some community college courses to fulfill those while working part-time. Meanwhile, as I did more research, I decided to enroll in an undergraduate civil engineering program, since I had to do so many prerequisites anyway and I wanted to be able to sit for the PE in the minimum amount of years. So a few years later, I'm done with my undergraduate degree in civil engineering, and am working full-time at an engineering firm while I am finishing up my master's part-time.

    Things I wish I had known:
    - A master's isn't really that valued going entry-level into a job. That trajectory might give you a little bit more of a pay bump when you go in, but I wasn't hired for my master's, I was hired for my undergraduate and internship experience.
    - It's really hard to stay focused in a master's program when you're working full-time, especially when the work may be not directly-related to my work. I have had the opportunity to do some school projects that were helpful to share at work, and use work to inform some of my school projects, etc. but my thesis is not directly related to my work (I started the thesis work before I started FT work) and I'm having a hard time "selling" that batch of unique skills with my current employer.

    Things I'm glad I did:
    - Getting an undergraduate civil engineering degree. My knowledge is so much more well-rounded as a result, and I don't have to worry about extra recommendations, etc. to be able to qualify for the PE. It's nice to have an EIT after my name too.

    What I wish I would have done / might recommend to you:
    - As others have suggested, start working. Get experience, even as a field tech or a CAD tech or something. It's a skill that will apply directly to your engineering experience and will make you stand out against other engineers.
    - I think I would have just started working full-time (or even part-time, if that works better for you, although typically tuition reimbursement is only available to FT employees) at an engineering firm and work really hard (part-time) at an undergraduate program to finish off the civil engineering. I think it would be okay to do a master's too (especially if you have most of the prereqs), since the coursework-only track is just a glorified, more specialized undergraduate degree in my opinion (i.e. can be very broad and has easy-to-reach requirements to graduate). Ideally, though, to take full advantage of the master's experience, I probably would have only done a master's thesis that was directly related to my work so they can feed into each other. 

    Those are my 2 cents! I will also say I have a co-worker who completed a master's degree without an undergraduate in civil and is currently working at an engineering firm, although he doesn't have an EIT. It believe it was was a hard sell for a firm to hire him, though, and he had a short career in teaching high school before getting picked up by a firm.

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    Kristine Mosuela EIT, S.M.ASCE
    Water Resources Engineer
    Centreville VA
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  • 10.  RE: Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

    Posted 08-27-2019 07:43 AM
    Hello Kristine,

    This provides me with some good insight. Thank you for your comments.

    I should note, for reference, that I am already in a regulated profession, a part from engineering. An added benefit I see going forward is to complete my geology  degree then take the Fundamentals of Geology (FG) to qualify as a Geologist in Training (GIT). After a couple of years of work you take the Practice of Geology (PG). The process is kind of a carbon copy of that of the engineering discipline, with a different subject matter of course. This I see is an added benefit for staying in geology in the short term then going on to do engineering. I can become fully qualified in both areas. I may come from strictly a geology background but even if I went the masters route I would tend to think a geotech or water office would see an intensive background in geology as an asset, no?

    I should note that if I did masters program it would be all in with any work being done through the department like an RAship of TAship, something that would most certainly work the best in tandem with earning the degree. I also will not start until I am financially stable enough or independent enough, with some debt paid down.

    I like your sub discipline probably the most actually, and particularly hydraulic engineering. If there were a masters I would be willing to do in civil that specialized in one area it would probably be water engineering. Plus it gives you some geotech, environmental and I believe even to an extent structural, just depending on the program.

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    Raul Gil S.M.ASCE
    Las Cruces NM
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  • 11.  RE: Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

    Posted 08-28-2019 07:02 PM
    I could see a couple tracks where a specialization in geology may be helpful:
    - Environmental Engineering
    - Geotechnical Engineering
    - In Water Resources Engineering, I could see an application if you're specializing in something like dam hydraulics, or scour analysis, but I'm not too well-versed in this. I think as far as floodplain modeling goes (which is my particular specialty), geology is less useful, unless perhaps you're looking into studies in karst-impacted regions.

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    Kristine Mosuela EIT, S.M.ASCE
    Water Resources Engineer
    Centreville VA
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  • 12.  RE: Non-engineer looking to enter the Civil Engineering profession

    Posted 08-27-2019 10:35 AM
    Raul, 

    I think Geology is well tied to civil engineering, especially with those you are interested in. It sounds to me like you should be able to pursue a career in Civil Engineering given your geology background. There is an interesting article by @Anthony Fasano that you can find here ​that talks about this topic. I have been researching what kind of schooling and experience combination someone can have to get licensed and there are multiple options. I would recommend you look up your state's requirements. Not having a BS in Civil Engineering is not the end of the world, but I would recommend you try to pursue an MS to get further education as well as meet some schooling requirements for the licensure. For instance, in Colorado, you can take the EI exam right after school with a 4-year related science degree and be enrolled after 2 years. After that, you could get your PE in another 4 years for a total of 6 years upon graduation. This may vary from state to state but it is just an example of the process. 

    Don't hesitate to reach out if you have any questions and I hope this was of help.

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    Luis Duque EIT, A.M.ASCE
    Structural Engineer
    Broomfield CO
    luis@...
    [Phone][Phone2]
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