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  • 1.  Are we doomed to repeat history?

    Posted 08-21-2025 04:58 PM

    Are we doomed to repeat history? I have Hurricane Katrina on top of mind as we approach the 20th anniversary of the storm and the ensuing tragedy. Following Katrina, the ASCE conducted a comprehensive study to understand what went wrong and what lessons were learned. This work included several impactful recommendations with broad applicability to flood-prone areas. Have we learned from this experience as a profession? Here is a link to a publicly available version of the ASCE report if you have not seen or need a reminder.

    https://biotech.law.lsu.edu/katrina/reports/erpreport.pdf



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    Mitch Winkler P.E.(inactive), M.ASCE
    Houston, TX
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  • 2.  RE: Are we doomed to repeat history?

    Posted 08-24-2025 07:12 PM

    It would be great to hear from someone who served on the External Review Panel or one of the ASCE staffers who supported this work.



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    Mitch Winkler P.E.(inactive), M.ASCE
    Houston, TX
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  • 3.  RE: Are we doomed to repeat history?

    Posted 08-25-2025 12:08 PM

    I am a Past-President of the Louisiana Section of the American Society of Civil Engineers and served as a senior consulting hydrologist to the Southeast Louisiana Flood Protection Authority-East (New Orleans east-bank) from 2010 to 2016 and to the Amite River Basin Commission (Baton Rouge region) from 2003 to 2022.

    What really caused the tragic failure of the NO perimeter system during Katrina?

    Among many contributing factors, one was overriding:  a bungled shift in priority from Protection (public safety) to Ri$k Reduction (damages).

    Dating back to the early 1990s, federal, state, and local officials ALL were distracted by NFIP incentives to reduce the flood insurance mandate zone and premium costs. This led directly to:

    ·         Prioritizing other federally funded projects, especially the SELA urban drainage upgrade (given the 1989 deluge).

    ·         Protracted deferral of serious perimeter system design and construction issues.

    ·         And federal, state, and local officials ALL avoiding implications-especially catastrophic breach risk.

    Could it happen again?

    The improved perimeter system is now explicitly named the Hurricane and Storm Damage Risk Reduction System.

    The system is higher and stronger than prior to Katrina; properly operated and maintained it dramatically reduces hurricane surge insurance cost.

    Levee and floodwall segments include some contingency freeboard; but over future decades there remains a significant chance for wave overtopping somewhere; thankfully, wave overtopping alone does not cause catastrophic inundation.

    The system also includes some additional structural resilience against breaching; but freeboard and breach resilience are not the same at all segments.

    Crucially: the system-with limited freeboard and resilience-is only certified for Property Damage Insurance purposes; the system is NOT certified (or certifiable) for Safety/Protection.

    SO YES:  while the chances are low, catastrophic breach flooding of some part of New Orleans could happen again.

    Let's ALL face up to the system flood Ri$k Reduction purpose, its benefits and limitations, and THE IMPLICATIONS: Buy flood insurance!  Plan for evacuation!  And support proper system O&M and additional cost-effective Ri$k reduction!

    See NO East-Bank Hurricane Surge Residual Risk Reduction Report, 2016, Bob Jacobsen PE for SLFPA-E

    Also see:



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    Robert Jacobsen P.E., M.ASCE
    President
    Baton Rouge LA
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  • 4.  RE: Are we doomed to repeat history?

    Posted 08-27-2025 09:53 AM

    Thanks for sharing your knowledge and insight. Do you know if anyone ever 'scorecarded' the completed system and its current organization against the recommendations of the ASCE task force and USACE Interagency Performance Evaluation Task Force (IPET)?  Should this be done?



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    Mitch Winkler P.E.(inactive), M.ASCE
    Houston, TX
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  • 5.  RE: Are we doomed to repeat history?

    Posted 08-27-2025 11:38 AM
    The only relevant "score" at this point is NFIP (insurance cost reduction) accreditation.  
    Until someone is willing to pay for a surge rating at each "link in the chain" allowing for a proper Factor of "Safety"-i.e., excess load contingency and probability for component failures (based on proper design calcs and material & as-built data-e.g., soil borings, compaction data). 

    Sent from my iPhone

    On Aug 27, 2025, at 8:55 AM, Mitchell Winkler via ASCE Collaborate <Mail@...> wrote:

    
    Thanks for sharing your knowledge and insight. Do you know if anyone ever 'scorecarded' the completed system and its current organization against...





  • 6.  RE: Are we doomed to repeat history?

    Posted 09-01-2025 09:24 PM

    The HSDRR System was extensively studied and was reconstructed by USACE (post Katrina) , using their risk based design approach. Various potential failure modes were analyzed, including overtopping . James P Moore, PE 



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    James Moore P.E., M.ASCE
    Vice President
    Mount Pocono PA
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  • 7.  RE: Are we doomed to repeat history?

    Posted 09-02-2025 11:36 AM

    I have no reason to doubt the integrity of the work that was done. For completeness, those involved in the studies should follow up to see that their recommendations were acted on, or at least taken into consideration. It's an issue of accountability to those who call New Orleans home. I was one until I moved from the area in 2006. There is also an issue of learning from failures, and have the lessons learned from Katrina been applied elsewhere?



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    Mitch Winkler P.E.(inactive), M.ASCE
    Houston, TX
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