Horizontal/Subsurface Infrastructure & Transportation

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

​You don't say what kind of clinker you are dealing with.  In my experience, clinker may or may not be chemically stable. One of my clients decided to pave a wharf area.  The site preparation included removing a cement klinker stockpile.  They left some of it behind thinking it would serve as a good base course for the asphalt pavement.  Only days after paving the area, the asphalt started to bubble up where the old stockpile had been located.  Cause of the pavement failure was determined to be hydration of the clinker.

------------------------------
Howard Thomas P.Eng, P.E., F.ASCE
Senior Technologist
Vancouver WA
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

In my case it is horizontal component of clinkers load causing the 8'' thick rcc wall to tilt out!

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-14-2017 01:23
From: Howard Thomas
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

​You don't say what kind of clinker you are dealing with.  In my experience, clinker may or may not be chemically stable. One of my clients decided to pave a wharf area.  The site preparation included removing a cement klinker stockpile.  They left some of it behind thinking it would serve as a good base course for the asphalt pavement.  Only days after paving the area, the asphalt started to bubble up where the old stockpile had been located.  Cause of the pavement failure was determined to be hydration of the clinker.

------------------------------
Howard Thomas P.Eng, P.E., F.ASCE
Senior Technologist
Vancouver WA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Please find two photographs, one taken from south corner to show the extent of tilt, the shows the resulting curve increasing with height.
i'll also Post the foundation sketch some time today.
hope this will help to dig into the problem.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

As per the photograph, wall is tilting inwards which is towards the clinkers. Kindly check if the foundation has settled or not.This case may occur due to differential settlement of soil below the foundation or due to failure of joint between wall and foundation.

------------------------------
Gurpreet Bhatia Aff.M.ASCE


------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-19-2017 21:42
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Please find two photographs, one taken from south corner to show the extent of tilt, the shows the resulting curve increasing with height.
i'll also Post the foundation sketch some time today.
hope this will help to dig into the problem.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Thanks for your reply, but the wall is tilted outside, the clinker is clearly seen stored inside.
there is no settlement in the foundation so far!

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-21-2017 03:20
From: Gurpreet Bhatia
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

As per the photograph, wall is tilting inwards which is towards the clinkers. Kindly check if the foundation has settled or not.This case may occur due to differential settlement of soil below the foundation or due to failure of joint between wall and foundation.

------------------------------
Gurpreet Bhatia Aff.M.ASCE



Original Message:
Sent: 11-19-2017 21:42
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Please find two photographs, one taken from south corner to show the extent of tilt, the shows the resulting curve increasing with height.
i'll also Post the foundation sketch some time today.
hope this will help to dig into the problem.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

​Based on what I see in the photographs, I am convinced that the problem is excessive lateral pressure exerted by the stockpiled clinker. Although the pictures do not show much detail along the base of the wall, I do not see anything to suggest foundation failure. It will be important to get accurate information about the unit weight and angle of internal friction of the clinker and to check if the stockpile material shows any evidence of hydration that could be contributing lateral pressure above and beyond the normal active soil pressure. Until those questions are resolved and remedial measures implemented, I suggest that the portion of the stockpile directly behind the wall be cut back to reduce the height of clinker bearing on the wall.

------------------------------
Fernando Souto P.E., M.ASCE
Senior Project Manager
Cadillac MI
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-19-2017 21:42
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Please find two photographs, one taken from south corner to show the extent of tilt, the shows the resulting curve increasing with height.
i'll also Post the foundation sketch some time today.
hope this will help to dig into the problem.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Thanks for the suggestion, I agree with you 100%. I had suggested the owner the same, reduce the height of the stockpile of clinker to remove part of the lateral pressure on wall.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-21-2017 16:16
From: Fernando Souto
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

​Based on what I see in the photographs, I am convinced that the problem is excessive lateral pressure exerted by the stockpiled clinker. Although the pictures do not show much detail along the base of the wall, I do not see anything to suggest foundation failure. It will be important to get accurate information about the unit weight and angle of internal friction of the clinker and to check if the stockpile material shows any evidence of hydration that could be contributing lateral pressure above and beyond the normal active soil pressure. Until those questions are resolved and remedial measures implemented, I suggest that the portion of the stockpile directly behind the wall be cut back to reduce the height of clinker bearing on the wall.

------------------------------
Fernando Souto P.E., M.ASCE
Senior Project Manager
Cadillac MI

Original Message:
Sent: 11-19-2017 21:42
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Please find two photographs, one taken from south corner to show the extent of tilt, the shows the resulting curve increasing with height.
i'll also Post the foundation sketch some time today.
hope this will help to dig into the problem.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Hello,

I tried to read all the questions and answers and understand the problem. I am afraid I still do not have a complete understanding of the situation.  You indicated that based on economic considerations you changed the design from cantilever to fixed ends and designed it as a 10' x 10' panel. How did you provide the rigidity to make it perform as fixed ends? What if the retaining wall is acting as cantilever? The other point to consider is correct placement of reinforcement during construction. I have seen where inexperienced construction crew had placed reinforcement on the wrong side of cantilevered projection. A more complete and detailed description of the design, construction and issue-at-hand would allow better evaluation and recommendation. I am not sure if the wall is bulging out maximum at the center of both axes (height and length) or it is uniformly tilting out from bottom to top?  Are there any cracks in the wall and what is their orientation?

------------------------------
Jahangir Khan P.E., M.ASCE
Principle
AAA Tru Tech, Inc.
Manassas VA
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-22-2017 01:25
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for the suggestion, I agree with you 100%. I had suggested the owner the same, reduce the height of the stockpile of clinker to remove part of the lateral pressure on wall.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-21-2017 16:16
From: Fernando Souto
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

​Based on what I see in the photographs, I am convinced that the problem is excessive lateral pressure exerted by the stockpiled clinker. Although the pictures do not show much detail along the base of the wall, I do not see anything to suggest foundation failure. It will be important to get accurate information about the unit weight and angle of internal friction of the clinker and to check if the stockpile material shows any evidence of hydration that could be contributing lateral pressure above and beyond the normal active soil pressure. Until those questions are resolved and remedial measures implemented, I suggest that the portion of the stockpile directly behind the wall be cut back to reduce the height of clinker bearing on the wall.

------------------------------
Fernando Souto P.E., M.ASCE
Senior Project Manager
Cadillac MI

Original Message:
Sent: 11-19-2017 21:42
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Please find two photographs, one taken from south corner to show the extent of tilt, the shows the resulting curve increasing with height.
i'll also Post the foundation sketch some time today.
hope this will help to dig into the problem.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Thanks for your interest and concern.
The rigidity to the wall is provided by columns at 10' c/c and tie beam at plinth and at 15' height. The beam at 15' was supposed to be at 10' but was moved at a higher level in intentionally by owners suggestions.
Reinforcement bars are provided according to the drawing.​

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-23-2017 08:47
From: Jahangir Khan
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello,

I tried to read all the questions and answers and understand the problem. I am afraid I still do not have a complete understanding of the situation.  You indicated that based on economic considerations you changed the design from cantilever to fixed ends and designed it as a 10' x 10' panel. How did you provide the rigidity to make it perform as fixed ends? What if the retaining wall is acting as cantilever? The other point to consider is correct placement of reinforcement during construction. I have seen where inexperienced construction crew had placed reinforcement on the wrong side of cantilevered projection. A more complete and detailed description of the design, construction and issue-at-hand would allow better evaluation and recommendation. I am not sure if the wall is bulging out maximum at the center of both axes (height and length) or it is uniformly tilting out from bottom to top?  Are there any cracks in the wall and what is their orientation?

------------------------------
Jahangir Khan P.E., M.ASCE
Principle
AAA Tru Tech, Inc.
Manassas VA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-22-2017 01:25
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for the suggestion, I agree with you 100%. I had suggested the owner the same, reduce the height of the stockpile of clinker to remove part of the lateral pressure on wall.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-21-2017 16:16
From: Fernando Souto
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

​Based on what I see in the photographs, I am convinced that the problem is excessive lateral pressure exerted by the stockpiled clinker. Although the pictures do not show much detail along the base of the wall, I do not see anything to suggest foundation failure. It will be important to get accurate information about the unit weight and angle of internal friction of the clinker and to check if the stockpile material shows any evidence of hydration that could be contributing lateral pressure above and beyond the normal active soil pressure. Until those questions are resolved and remedial measures implemented, I suggest that the portion of the stockpile directly behind the wall be cut back to reduce the height of clinker bearing on the wall.

------------------------------
Fernando Souto P.E., M.ASCE
Senior Project Manager
Cadillac MI

Original Message:
Sent: 11-19-2017 21:42
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Please find two photographs, one taken from south corner to show the extent of tilt, the shows the resulting curve increasing with height.
i'll also Post the foundation sketch some time today.
hope this will help to dig into the problem.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

The photographs were not very helpful due to the angle.  Failures of this type are almost always found in the foundation, insufficient width and depth of the foundation to resist rotation or insufficient steel in the foundation/wall joint or both. If the exterior part of the foundation is still level at the point of maximum deflection then the problem is in the foundation/wall joint.  The common fix is exterior bracing if space considerations allow.
Recheck your assumptions on the allowable bearing pressure of the soil under both wet and dry conditions.

------------------------------
James Anderson, MASCE
Principal
Anderson Consulting
North Richland Hills, TX
817-946-9943
James
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-22-2017 01:25
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for the suggestion, I agree with you 100%. I had suggested the owner the same, reduce the height of the stockpile of clinker to remove part of the lateral pressure on wall.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-21-2017 16:16
From: Fernando Souto
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

​Based on what I see in the photographs, I am convinced that the problem is excessive lateral pressure exerted by the stockpiled clinker. Although the pictures do not show much detail along the base of the wall, I do not see anything to suggest foundation failure. It will be important to get accurate information about the unit weight and angle of internal friction of the clinker and to check if the stockpile material shows any evidence of hydration that could be contributing lateral pressure above and beyond the normal active soil pressure. Until those questions are resolved and remedial measures implemented, I suggest that the portion of the stockpile directly behind the wall be cut back to reduce the height of clinker bearing on the wall.

------------------------------
Fernando Souto P.E., M.ASCE
Senior Project Manager
Cadillac MI

Original Message:
Sent: 11-19-2017 21:42
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Please find two photographs, one taken from south corner to show the extent of tilt, the shows the resulting curve increasing with height.
i'll also Post the foundation sketch some time today.
hope this will help to dig into the problem.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

​Thanks for your observation.
Although I had uploaded the foundation sketch in response to your post, it seems it did not get posted.
Here is the foundation sketch again. Please note that the tie beam at 12' above Plinth was moved to 15' height.

Peter.


------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Thanks for the sketch!  Unless the 12" x 12" tie beam is connected to something besides the wall and the columns the entire system appears to be operating as a cantilever system and not a panel system.  If the system is operating as a cantilever system, the foundation system appears to be "way too skinny" for such a tall wall.  You would need a thicker, wider pad with significantly more steel to transfer the wall and column forces to that pad.  Is there space on the outside of the wall to install buttressing to resist the horizontal clinker forces?

------------------------------
James Anderson, MASCE
Principal
Anderson Consulting
North Richland Hills, TX
817-946-9943
James
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-23-2017 06:46
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

​Thanks for your observation.
Although I had uploaded the foundation sketch in response to your post, it seems it did not get posted.
Here is the foundation sketch again. Please note that the tie beam at 12' above Plinth was moved to 15' height.

Peter.


------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

The deflected shape does not appear to resemble that of a cantilever in flexure laterally loaded from the clinker.  The concrete columns are taller than the wall and since they are unbraced (out of plane) these too should have a cantilever deflected shape.  Based on your photograph, the curvature/deflected shape resembles a simply supported beam if the footing is unable to accommodate the bending moment or a propped cantilever if footing can accommodate the bending moment.  See diagrams below: Cantilever deflected shape (sketched in MS Word)

is it possible that the roof structure is acting as a tie thereby preventing the deflected shape you expected?  The photos don't show how the roof and the RC columns interact, however, you should check and confirm this.  You also need to confirm that the footing is adequately sized and wall reinforced sufficiently considering that the columns appear to be unbraced out of <g class="gr_ gr_941 gr-alert gr_gramm gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim Grammar only-ins doubleReplace replaceWithoutSep" id="941" data-gr-id="941">plane</g> as previously mentioned.

------------------------------
Greg Parris M.ASCE
CE
CEP Ltd

------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-25-2017 09:32
From: James Anderson
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for the sketch!  Unless the 12" x 12" tie beam is connected to something besides the wall and the columns the entire system appears to be operating as a cantilever system and not a panel system.  If the system is operating as a cantilever system, the foundation system appears to be "way too skinny" for such a tall wall.  You would need a thicker, wider pad with significantly more steel to transfer the wall and column forces to that pad.  Is there space on the outside of the wall to install buttressing to resist the horizontal clinker forces?

------------------------------
James Anderson, MASCE
Principal
Anderson Consulting
North Richland Hills, TX
817-946-9943
James

Original Message:
Sent: 11-23-2017 06:46
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

​Thanks for your observation.
Although I had uploaded the foundation sketch in response to your post, it seems it did not get posted.
Here is the foundation sketch again. Please note that the tie beam at 12' above Plinth was moved to 15' height.

Peter.


------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

You have a good point.  The photo does appear to be more of a bulge than a tilt.  The columns are likely connected to the floor system above.  While that could cause the system to act partially as a simply supported system it could cause some additional problems at the connection with that floor system if the horizontal forces on the wall/column system are greater than anticipated.

------------------------------
James Anderson, MASCE
Principal
Anderson Consulting
North Richland Hills, TX
817-946-9943
James
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-28-2017 08:28
From: Greg Parris
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

The deflected shape does not appear to resemble that of a cantilever in flexure laterally loaded from the clinker.  The concrete columns are taller than the wall and since they are unbraced (out of plane) these too should have a cantilever deflected shape.  Based on your photograph, the curvature/deflected shape resembles a simply supported beam if the footing is unable to accommodate the bending moment or a propped cantilever if footing can accommodate the bending moment.  See diagrams below:

Cantilever deflected shape (sketched in MS Word)

is it possible that the roof structure is acting as a tie thereby preventing the deflected shape you expected?  The photos don't show how the roof and the RC columns interact, however, you should check and confirm this.  You also need to confirm that the footing is adequately sized and wall reinforced sufficiently considering that the columns appear to be unbraced out of <g class="gr_ gr_941 gr-alert gr_gramm gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim Grammar only-ins doubleReplace replaceWithoutSep" id="941" data-gr-id="941">plane</g> as previously mentioned.

------------------------------
Greg Parris M.ASCE
CE
CEP Ltd


Original Message:
Sent: 11-25-2017 09:32
From: James Anderson
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for the sketch!  Unless the 12" x 12" tie beam is connected to something besides the wall and the columns the entire system appears to be operating as a cantilever system and not a panel system.  If the system is operating as a cantilever system, the foundation system appears to be "way too skinny" for such a tall wall.  You would need a thicker, wider pad with significantly more steel to transfer the wall and column forces to that pad.  Is there space on the outside of the wall to install buttressing to resist the horizontal clinker forces?

------------------------------
James Anderson, MASCE
Principal
Anderson Consulting
North Richland Hills, TX
817-946-9943
James

Original Message:
Sent: 11-23-2017 06:46
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

​Thanks for your observation.
Although I had uploaded the foundation sketch in response to your post, it seems it did not get posted.
Here is the foundation sketch again. Please note that the tie beam at 12' above Plinth was moved to 15' height.

Peter.


------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

There is no crack or settlement in the foundation, the deflection starts just above plinth tie at the centre of the wall length and grows as the height increases, both horizontally and vertically, making a bigger curve at the top.
The effected wall columns are not connected to the roof truss. Both side columns support the roof.
Your first sketch identifies with the deflection.
How ever, the deflection (2'6") at the top is remaining static, there is no increase and we have started providing 12" thick rcc wall buttresses, 6' at plinth and sloping to 15" at 12' level with 6'x7'x15" thick raft foundation 10' apart to prevent future possibility of added deflection.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-28-2017 08:28
From: Greg Parris
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

The deflected shape does not appear to resemble that of a cantilever in flexure laterally loaded from the clinker.  The concrete columns are taller than the wall and since they are unbraced (out of plane) these too should have a cantilever deflected shape.  Based on your photograph, the curvature/deflected shape resembles a simply supported beam if the footing is unable to accommodate the bending moment or a propped cantilever if footing can accommodate the bending moment.  See diagrams below:

Cantilever deflected shape (sketched in MS Word)

is it possible that the roof structure is acting as a tie thereby preventing the deflected shape you expected?  The photos don't show how the roof and the RC columns interact, however, you should check and confirm this.  You also need to confirm that the footing is adequately sized and wall reinforced sufficiently considering that the columns appear to be unbraced out of <g class="gr_ gr_941 gr-alert gr_gramm gr_inline_cards gr_run_anim Grammar only-ins doubleReplace replaceWithoutSep" id="941" data-gr-id="941">plane</g> as previously mentioned.

------------------------------
Greg Parris M.ASCE
CE
CEP Ltd


Original Message:
Sent: 11-25-2017 09:32
From: James Anderson
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for the sketch!  Unless the 12" x 12" tie beam is connected to something besides the wall and the columns the entire system appears to be operating as a cantilever system and not a panel system.  If the system is operating as a cantilever system, the foundation system appears to be "way too skinny" for such a tall wall.  You would need a thicker, wider pad with significantly more steel to transfer the wall and column forces to that pad.  Is there space on the outside of the wall to install buttressing to resist the horizontal clinker forces?

------------------------------
James Anderson, MASCE
Principal
Anderson Consulting
North Richland Hills, TX
817-946-9943
James

Original Message:
Sent: 11-23-2017 06:46
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

​Thanks for your observation.
Although I had uploaded the foundation sketch in response to your post, it seems it did not get posted.
Here is the foundation sketch again. Please note that the tie beam at 12' above Plinth was moved to 15' height.

Peter.


------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Thanks for your insight.
Yes, there is space available and to support the tilting wall and columns (which has stopped at 2'6" at top), we have started building buttresses 10' apart, having a raft foundation of 7'x6'x1'3"and a wall 7'x12" upto pl, then sloping to 15" upto 12' height!
Hope this will provide stability in future and prevent from further tilting.
There is no settlement evident in the foundation so far.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-25-2017 09:32
From: James Anderson
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for the sketch!  Unless the 12" x 12" tie beam is connected to something besides the wall and the columns the entire system appears to be operating as a cantilever system and not a panel system.  If the system is operating as a cantilever system, the foundation system appears to be "way too skinny" for such a tall wall.  You would need a thicker, wider pad with significantly more steel to transfer the wall and column forces to that pad.  Is there space on the outside of the wall to install buttressing to resist the horizontal clinker forces?

------------------------------
James Anderson, MASCE
Principal
Anderson Consulting
North Richland Hills, TX
817-946-9943
James

Original Message:
Sent: 11-23-2017 06:46
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

​Thanks for your observation.
Although I had uploaded the foundation sketch in response to your post, it seems it did not get posted.
Here is the foundation sketch again. Please note that the tie beam at 12' above Plinth was moved to 15' height.

Peter.


------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

I agree that the wall is not acting in a cantilever fashion.  I had looked at the pictures on my iphone so the details were not very clear.  Now when I reviewed them on a big screen, it seems to me that the wall is bulging out along its length.  The columns and beams are not providing the required rigidity.  It seems that the wall end conditions are:  fixed at the top (roof), fixed at the bottom (foundation, passive soil resistance and beam at the plinth level), fixed at the end which is restrained by transverse wall and simply supported by the column at the free end (this end could be acting as "free" depending on the rigidity of the end column).  Under such end conditions, the wall would require tension reinforcement, in the mid spans in both directions, more so along the length (horizontal span) of the wall.  I see vertical reinforcement close to the outside face of the wall but there is no horizontal reinforcement along the length, the more critical span.  The longitudinal span needs to be strengthened.

I would rule out any failure of the foundation due to rotation because of the stabilising effect of the stored clinker weight.

------------------------------
Jahangir Khan P.E., M.ASCE
Principle
AAA Tru Tech, Inc.
Manassas VA
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-25-2017 09:32
From: James Anderson
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for the sketch!  Unless the 12" x 12" tie beam is connected to something besides the wall and the columns the entire system appears to be operating as a cantilever system and not a panel system.  If the system is operating as a cantilever system, the foundation system appears to be "way too skinny" for such a tall wall.  You would need a thicker, wider pad with significantly more steel to transfer the wall and column forces to that pad.  Is there space on the outside of the wall to install buttressing to resist the horizontal clinker forces?

------------------------------
James Anderson, MASCE
Principal
Anderson Consulting
North Richland Hills, TX
817-946-9943
James

Original Message:
Sent: 11-23-2017 06:46
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

​Thanks for your observation.
Although I had uploaded the foundation sketch in response to your post, it seems it did not get posted.
Here is the foundation sketch again. Please note that the tie beam at 12' above Plinth was moved to 15' height.

Peter.


------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

​Hello Friends,
I am grateful to each and every one of you who have been kind enough to devote your time and effort and have participated in the discussion in order to help me resolve the problem.
Please accept my heartfelt thanks, specially Mr Jahangir Khan and Mr. James Anderson, for your analysis of the situation, your insights and your valuable suggestions. I am so much grateful to ASCE for making this platform available for discussion.
Thanks.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------

Original Message:
Sent: 11-29-2017 12:06
From: Jahangir Khan
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

I agree that the wall is not acting in a cantilever fashion.  I had looked at the pictures on my iphone so the details were not very clear.  Now when I reviewed them on a big screen, it seems to me that the wall is bulging out along its length.  The columns and beams are not providing the required rigidity.  It seems that the wall end conditions are:  fixed at the top (roof), fixed at the bottom (foundation, passive soil resistance and beam at the plinth level), fixed at the end which is restrained by transverse wall and simply supported by the column at the free end (this end could be acting as "free" depending on the rigidity of the end column).  Under such end conditions, the wall would require tension reinforcement, in the mid spans in both directions, more so along the length (horizontal span) of the wall.  I see vertical reinforcement close to the outside face of the wall but there is no horizontal reinforcement along the length, the more critical span.  The longitudinal span needs to be strengthened.

I would rule out any failure of the foundation due to rotation because of the stabilising effect of the stored clinker weight.

------------------------------
Jahangir Khan P.E., M.ASCE
Principle
AAA Tru Tech, Inc.
Manassas VA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-25-2017 09:32
From: James Anderson
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for the sketch!  Unless the 12" x 12" tie beam is connected to something besides the wall and the columns the entire system appears to be operating as a cantilever system and not a panel system.  If the system is operating as a cantilever system, the foundation system appears to be "way too skinny" for such a tall wall.  You would need a thicker, wider pad with significantly more steel to transfer the wall and column forces to that pad.  Is there space on the outside of the wall to install buttressing to resist the horizontal clinker forces?

------------------------------
James Anderson, MASCE
Principal
Anderson Consulting
North Richland Hills, TX
817-946-9943
James

Original Message:
Sent: 11-23-2017 06:46
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

​Thanks for your observation.
Although I had uploaded the foundation sketch in response to your post, it seems it did not get posted.
Here is the foundation sketch again. Please note that the tie beam at 12' above Plinth was moved to 15' height.

Peter.


------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 16:42
From: Thomas Richards
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

A sketch would be very helpful. Is there a way to share a cross-section?

------------------------------
Thomas Richards P.E., D.GE, M.ASCE
Chief Engineer
Nicholson Construction Co
Pittsburgh PA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-16-2017 02:39
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Thanks for your reply.
The foundation is 6' wide strip 8'' plus 10'' slope with 12''x15'' continuous beam at center. The wall originated from this beam, there is a tie beam at 7' height and the wall continues to a height of 12' above tie/ plinth.
hope this helps.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj

Original Message:
Sent: 11-15-2017 07:46
From: Dewayne Heintz
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Assume worst case lateral pressure as if it were a non-cohesive clean aggregate. You discussed the thickness of the wall but made no mention of what type of foundation you have. I'm guessing that may be your problem area.

------------------------------
Dewayne Heintz EI, A.M.ASCE
Project Manager
L.L. Pelling Company
North Liberty IA

Original Message:
Sent: 11-10-2017 01:58
From: Peter Singh
Subject: Wall tilting due to clinker weight

Hello friends,
Recently I have designed and provided construction supervision of a clinker storage shed. Two walls are designed to retain clinker and two are left open. The load bearing walls were designed as cantilever retaining walls with a height of 10', with supercharged load. The designed thickness of wall came to 15''! In order to have an economical design, I redesigned the wall as load bearing fixed panel 10'x10' in size and the thickness came to 8''! So suggested the client accordingly.
Now about a week ago clinker was stored in the shed and the wall was supporting the clinker about 12' in ht. As a result the wall has tilted out of vertical plane about 2'6'' at centre.
i need to understand the loading pattern of clinker in storage, vertical and horizontal components of its weight and it's affects on retaining walls.

------------------------------
Peter Singh M.ASCE
Managing Director
Kingdom Designers
Birganj
------------------------------